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    Can someone get saved by a lie?

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    Rickster

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    Can someone get saved by a lie?

    Post  Rickster on April 18th 2011, 11:46 pm

    So I was just watching a video on the May 21 2011 (they have so many things wrong with this theory it's laughable) but the video was saying that many are getting saved because of this and this got me thinking can someone get saved even if the reasons for their salvation was false? (Not sure if I worded that write)
    I had another example but it has escape my mind when i ctach it i'll post it also

    mindspike
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    Re: Can someone get saved by a lie?

    Post  mindspike on April 19th 2011, 10:13 am

    Phillipians 1 (WE) wrote: 14Because I am in prison, most of my Christian brothers are stronger for the Lord. They are strong in the faith now and they are not afraid to tell God's good news about Jesus Christ.
    15Some of them tell about Christ because they are jealous. They want to prove they are better than me. Some of them tell about Christ because they want to help me.
    16The first ones do it because they want to prove they are better than I am. They do not have a good reason. But they think they will make trouble for me while I am in prison.
    17These last ones do it because they love me. They know that I am here to speak for the good news.
    18But it does not matter. Every way, in the wrong way or in the right way, Christ is talked about. I will be glad because of that.

    Believing or acting upon false information seems unlikely to lead to true salvation, except where that information is used to contrast against the truth. If salvation (that is, the state of justification and the process of sanctification) were strictly or primarily an intellectual matter, then I would say authoritatively that believing a lie cannot lead to effectual salvation. Since this is solely a spiritual matter driven by the uninfluenced choice of God (doctrine of Election), then what does it matter, but that Christ is preached?!

    Although this passage addresses motive rather than substance, the argument extends to incomplete or incorrect information being used to provide saving knowledge to God's Elect. The two best examples of this being the Ethiopian official in the book of Acts, whose knowledge of the scripture was incorrect, and the Patriarchs, whose knowledge of the plan of salvation was incomplete.


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    WhiteBoy
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    Re: Can someone get saved by a lie?

    Post  WhiteBoy on April 19th 2011, 10:26 am

    When I was a kid I remember getting a booklet of "88 Reasons Jesus Is Coming Back In 1988." The next year it was "89 Reasons Jesus Is Coming Back In 1989." The next year was "90 Reasons Jesus Is Coming Back In 1990." I guess they finally figured out that maybe they missed the part in the Bible about "no one knows the day or hour." (Matt. 24:36).

    To answer you question, though, yes, I believe that the Lord can still use this to bring people to him. The thing is that salvation is a work of God and only God. He uses us to witness to people, but there's no magic words that we have to say or CAN say to people to cause them to believe. It is a work of the Spirit. The Spirit is what quickens their heart and causes them to have faith and believe.

    Now to clarify, they still have to have SOME truth. And to be saved, they have to believe the essential truths. I don't know what literature the group is passing out, but I assume it has some Scripture on it. The Lord can use this to draw them to Him and they could seek more in the Bible and find the truth.

    Another example I've thought of before is someone who has witnessed to others and led people to Christ, but then later realized they were not truly saved and became a Christian themselves. God still used them - as he uses all things - for His will. Check out Rom 8:28 and Gen 50:20.


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    Re: Can someone get saved by a lie?

    Post  Paeter on April 19th 2011, 6:59 pm

    I don't think I have anything to add. Really good responses here already. I'm curious about this video, though. Would you mind posting a link?


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    Re: Can someone get saved by a lie?

    Post  WhiteBoy on April 20th 2011, 10:18 am

    TBH, I didn't know what he was referring to. So I watched this video to see what he was referring to - .


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    Rickster

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    Re: Can someone get saved by a lie?

    Post  Rickster on April 20th 2011, 4:52 pm

    Paeter wrote:I don't think I have anything to add. Really good responses here already. I'm curious about this video, though. Would you mind posting a link?
    I'll make a post later on (maybe on May 22 lol) about it posting this guys theory.

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    Re: Can someone get saved by a lie?

    Post  Guest on May 4th 2011, 3:18 pm

    It seems to me that this group is playing with fire. In response to the original question, it may be that they will be ok if they have a core Christian belief: Jesus is the Son of God, died to save humanity from their sins, and belief in this truth is salvation. However...

    There's a lot of problems with the details they are embracing. How disillusioned are they going to be if/when they day they think it's going down comes and goes, and nothing happens. What then happens to their faith, do they loose their way even more by denying the truth and resetting the doomsday clock, or ditch the whole thing?

    They don't strike me as an effective representation of Christianity. How does a non-believer react to this? Will the average non-believer say, "I've seen this before. They got rid of all their possessions, left their lives behind. Did they give their possessions to to the organization that persuaded them to? Uh, huh; looks familiar."? Easily questionable, potentially contemptible.

    Just a personal thought, I don't think any branch of Christianity should be preoccupied with when the end times come. I've come across political analysis that this interest in the circumstances of the end times can result in a problematic approach to the world. I've even run across a fearful commentary, that goes so far as to suggest that there are fringe groups interested in cultivating political power for the purpose of guiding circumstances toward the pattern that they believe matches prophesy. Whether it's true or not, it shouldn't be boiling in the subconscious of Christian society. I won't deny that it's fun to speculate, it's great material for all sorts of interesting What If? stories, but in the end it's God's surprise to arrange. Too much Doomsday stuff is not great for the psyche.

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    Re: Can someone get saved by a lie?

    Post  Paeter on May 4th 2011, 4:35 pm

    Really good points, Kris. Thanks for adding those thoughts.


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