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    cleireac

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    Breaking News

    Post  cleireac on October 30th 2012, 4:49 pm

    Disney buys Lucasfilm; apparently this is real: http://www.benzinga.com/news/12/10/3039512/disney-to-buy-lucasfilm-for-4-05b-in-cash-and-stock

    Rickster

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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  Rickster on October 30th 2012, 10:08 pm

    Saw that there might be a 7 th Star Wars movie too or will it be an 8 th if you count the animated clone wars movie

    WhiteBoy
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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  WhiteBoy on October 30th 2012, 10:48 pm

    Well, the term used in the official Disney press release is "Episode 7." It'll be the eighth film, but I infer from that a continuation of Luke's story. They say they'll be making other films as well... one every three years or so.


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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  BenAvery on October 30th 2012, 11:45 pm

    We just a recorded a podcast about this -- what we hope happens and what we hope doesn't happen. Personally, there is reason to be both optimistic AND pessimistic.

    The way I see it, if they make a good movie . . . GREAT! One more awesome movie. If they make a bad movie, who cares? We've seen bad Star Wars in the past and the good is still there to be enjoyed.

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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  Guest on October 31st 2012, 12:37 am

    The main thing that's fun to contemplate is what they'll come up with for Star Wars VII. There seems to be a lot of polarized extreme reactions about it on theforce.net forums. Odd talk about "respecting" concepts of canon and continuity. I've read and loved (and continue to love) quite a lot of the novels and comic (though not remotely as many as some fans), and I'm happy to see an alternative take on events that follow on from RotJ, without dismissing either as no longer relevant; I'll keep what I like of both. That's a good plan, I feel.

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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  BenAvery on October 31st 2012, 12:47 am

    To me, the movies are the foundation that books, comics, etc. launch from., regardless of the franchise. (unless it is something like Babylon 5, which JMS specifically said a few of those issues were "canon").

    To me, if a movie contradicts some books, who cares? Actually, I know who cares . . . and I can see why people might be unhappy about it if they have spent a long time invested in those stories -- and my understanding is that Lucasfilm has done a pretty good job of keeping contradictions to a minimum between all the books, TV shows, comics, and movies. But it certainly does not bother me.

    I think I'm softening in my old age. I used to expect the worst, but I find myself hoping for the best but not caring if the worst happens.

    EDIT: Here's our Strangers and Aliens episode about the news: http://strangersandaliens.com/2012/10/episode-32-disneys-star-wars-initial-reaction/

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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  Dunadwarf on October 31st 2012, 11:35 am

    Star Wars is already in two separate continuities after the abysmal "Clone Wars" series. As hard as it is to fit the series within "Revenge of the Sith" since there's not even a token mention of Asohka (sp?), the books are absolutely not in canon with "The Clone Wars" with major details contradicting events and details from the books (Jabba specifically having no offspring, nor having had any in the past nor wanting any in the future, only a few years before "A New Hope" being a prime example).
    My point is that, although I love the Thrawn storyline and think that tghey are among the finest Star Wars novels, it's not necessary and might even be a mistake to adapt the Zhan books into the next movies (they are MUCH longer and more complex than even the expanded novelizations of any of the films). A third continuity just allows fans to choose which type of story they enjoy (or more than one so long as they don't expect them to mesh together).
    What I'd like to see come of this is the license for official alternate prequels to be written, not glued to the 3-story format the movies required and allowing for a completely different take on events that might actually satisfy fans.

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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  BenAvery on October 31st 2012, 1:03 pm

    As much as I don't like the prequels, I do not want a reboot. Lets go new -- completely new. I know that it means losing beloved character, but technically that has already happened. I was a Marvel guy, and I know they have tried to make ways for those comics to still be part of the official canon, to an extent, I always knew that those were just extra stories. The movies were what they were, the comics were cool and fun and filled the void while waiting for more movies, but I never expected them to line up exactly with the movies when a new movie came.

    This was even more evident with Star Trek because there is so much more of it.

    Just continue the story, and give me good story, and I'll be happy!

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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  Paeter on October 31st 2012, 1:44 pm

    A buddy texted me this news last night. My response?

    Awesome. Out of Lucas' hands = Monumental Improvement.

    Wondering if they'll try to jump ahead in the timeline to use the aging original cast, re-cast and pick up shortly after Episode 6, or jump even further ahead in the timeline (my choice) to begin a completely new saga about a future Skywalker.


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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  Guest on October 31st 2012, 4:17 pm

    Dunadwarf wrote:Star Wars is already in two separate continuities after the abysmal "Clone Wars" series.

    Shocked Well nothing's ever perfect, but I regard "abysmal" as a pretty extreme overstatement. The action sequences are enjoyable from an action fan's standpoint, characterization is given a reasonable amount of attention, the performances are fine, and they have fun with the character relationship dynamics.

    As hard as it is to fit the series within "Revenge of the Sith" since there's not even a token mention of Asohka (sp?)

    It only gave me pause for a moment. Asohka won me over pretty early on as a character that's good fun to watch; my feeling is that the Clone Wars show has a vibrant life of it's own. It's unfortunate that continuity is a blockade for enjoying the show. If you disagree about it's quality, rather than continuity, that's another thing.

    Is the Clone Wars show worse than the prequel trilogy? Interesting question. Before having a chance to see any documentaries featuring the creators' commentaries, I thought to myself "It's like they injected a large, healthy dose of classic Star Wars (Star Wars 1977 and The Empire Strikes Back) into the prequels era." Later on, I did see a documentary where the show's creators said exactly the same thing. This classic Trilogy spirit alone elevates Clone Wars over the uncomfortable awkwardness of The Phantom Menace and the heavy (nonsensical and confusing) plot emphasis of Attack of the Clones.

    the books are absolutely not in canon with "The Clone Wars" with major details contradicting events and details from the books (Jabba specifically having no offspring, nor having had any in the past nor wanting any in the future, only a few years before "A New Hope" being a prime example).

    Canon doesn't matter. Crackers don't matter! Mad

    Canonicity applied to a fictional universe is methodology of conceptualizing the components of a fictional universe, with an eye toward questioning which parts shouldn't be allowed to count. It is the result of fans being able to congregate in larger numbers than they ever have before, on the internet, and engaging in discourse that gets stuck in feedback loops.

    Notions of canon don't matter because fundamentally, the fictional universe and any additional fiction material that spin out from that creative core are fake don't matter. Canon arguments are used to justify why one part of the story should be disregarded as not being important, when the real fact is that all of it is not important. Wink

    Argue about The Clone Wars TV show on the basis of it's quality, yes? Tell me if you don't agree about my appraisal of the quality of it. A fictional universe is always going to cultivate continuity issues, given enough time to expand.

    How many fictionalized variations of the Arthur/Camelot story have you seen? Do we ever argue about the absence of Azeem in Errol Flynn's Robin Hood, or the newer BBC productions, or complain that for some reason he's called Asneeze in Men in Tights?!

    My point is that, although I love the Thrawn storyline and think that tghey are among the finest Star Wars novels, it's not necessary and might even be a mistake to adapt the Zhan books into the next movies (they are MUCH longer and more complex than even the expanded novelizations of any of the films).

    :thumbs up: I agree that the Thrawn books are very enjoyable, and will always regard them as a highly memorable, respectable variation on what happens after RotJ, as strong in my mind as what ever new movie comes out, that may even overwrite it. If it takes some inspiration from them, while still doing something vastly different and new and in the spirit of classic SW, I'll take 'em both! I don't think I want anything to be adapted, unless it's a character (interpreted differently, with a different journey) or a situation that is a spiritual echo of what inspired it.

    A third continuity just allows fans to choose which type of story they enjoy (or more than one so long as they don't expect them to mesh together).
    What I'd like to see come of this is the license for official alternate prequels to be written, not glued to the 3-story format the movies required and allowing for a completely different take on events that might actually satisfy fans.

    Only three..."continuities?" Star Wars as it stand could probably breath easier with more space for all the stories. Walrus-man Jabba the Hut as a distinct version of the crime boss, Asoka in one "continuity" as an important SW character who does get mentioned in a slightly different version of Revenge of the Sith, Jaster Mereel as the original name of Boba Fett as an alternative and equally relevant version of that character.

    As for alternative prequels, I can't see that ever happening for a long time, if ever. The way to move is forward.

    I had my own interpretation for how I thought the Clone Wars and Anakin/Darth Vader were supposed to be (whatever that means) while I was growing up. I went ahead an recaptured it on paper, because I knew how I had wanted it to be. I wanted to make my memory of it more concrete. As I wrote it out, a few surprises happened along the way. I'll bet George Lucas encountered his share of surprises in a similar way. The writing of it was a cathartic experience, and I came to a certain measure of peace with the prequels. I decided not to wait for someone else to come up with a better version of classic SW's backstory trilogy, so I wouldn't be unhappy with anything unexpected, but I still came out of that little recreational project with some nice surprises. I tried to imagine a world I thought I would never see, and then, one day...I got in! No, wait, hold on; sorry that's Tron. I wonder: what would Flynn do? Surprised Never mind. Anyway, in a fashion, I found a way to have two alternatives for the prequel story. Both are strong variations held in flux in my head, and that's enough for me.

    I am content for now, and look forward to what's coming with a seventh live-action SW movie, and what new ideas it will inspire.

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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  WhiteBoy on October 31st 2012, 4:54 pm

    Here's George Lucas's reasoning about the acquisition. Straight from George's mouth - http://youtu.be/YyqlTi7lkhY .


    Last edited by WhiteBoy on November 1st 2012, 2:47 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : fixed link)


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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  Guest on October 31st 2012, 6:21 pm

    WhiteBoy wrote:Here's George Lucas's reasoning about the acquisition. Straight from George's mouth - http://youtu.be/YyqlTi7lkhY.

    I don't know if that link is working too good... Question

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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  WhiteBoy on November 1st 2012, 2:48 pm

    Sorry... trailing period screwed it up. Fixed it.


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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  Dunadwarf on November 1st 2012, 5:05 pm

    I'd have to disagree with you about canon, Kris. It's not just a means for fans to pick and choose what they like. In fact, it's exactly the opposite.
    To me, the appeal of the Star Wars novels is that they're considered to be in a single continuity. Events and characters from one affect another story. Contrast that with, for example, Star Trek novels, which often disagree with one another or even episodes/movies that were produced later. It wasn't that interesting to follow a situation when you knew it would never have an impact beyond this novel and, MAYBE, future sequels to just that novel.
    Here's an example: The "Black Fleet Crisis" trilogy took place some 10-15 years after ROTJ. It pretty much stood on its own, with a whole new alien race (the Yevetha) for the Republic to fight. It ended and now there was just another group of aliens to rarely-if-ever be featured as background decorations. Then, in the paradigm-shifting "New Jedi Order" series, aliens from outside the galaxy came and devastated the Republic in a lasting way. One thing they did was to annihilate the Yevetha to the last being. Even though these Yevetha had been uninvolved in the intervening stories, this little detail was far more meaningful to represent the threat of these other aliens (along with a LOT of much more personal actions I wouldn't want to spoil for anyone reading for the first time) than if they'd just wiped out some new species we'd never heard of. That's a very minor example, but it demonstrates how the powers behind these novels chose wisely to make their novels consistent from one to another, even with whole new authors. It was so consistent, in fact, that they were able to publish a chronology that timelined and summarized these myriad stories and arcs and they needed only slight bits of padding to make them fit, mostly explaining what happened to so-and-so politically after this trilogy until their next appearance.
    "Clone Wars" was the first official Lucas work to so completely jar with this. What's more, it didn't fit stylistically with either the books or the movies. Indeed it really seems out of place in many ways, including the awful dialogue (when you're making Episode I seem well-written, you're really failing) and the over-powering of the Jedi and Sith into virtual gods rather than very skilled knights.
    It's a matter of preference, but my whole point was that now, thanks to this show, fans can't enjoy all Star Wars like a connected whole. They have to choose one or the other (movies and novels OR movies and TV series) or enjoy each one disconnected from the other. There's nothing wrong with that, but it does take away what, for me, was the biggest appeal of the expanded universe...that it all held together and that investing in one part helped make the other parts more vivid.

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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  BenAvery on November 1st 2012, 5:26 pm

    This is what happens whenever you have a continuity that does not just move forward, but that tries tell stories going back and in between and forward.

    Also, this is what happens when you begin producing dozens of books, but also hours of television. it gets unwieldy. And you either follow it to the letter . . . and risk alienating new viewers or readers . . . or your ignore it if it gets in the way of the story you want to tell.

    The main reason I don't read EU things from Star Wars? There's too much, and when I've tried, it references things I don't know about. It loses me. Rather than make me want to consume more of the EU, it makes me worry that when I pick up another book, I'll just come to that roadblock again.

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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  Nathan James Norman on November 2nd 2012, 6:58 am

    BenAvery wrote:This is what happens whenever you have a continuity that does not just move forward, but that tries tell stories going back and in between and forward.

    Also, this is what happens when you begin producing dozens of books, but also hours of television. it gets unwieldy. And you either follow it to the letter . . . and risk alienating new viewers or readers . . . or your ignore it if it gets in the way of the story you want to tell.

    The main reason I don't read EU things from Star Wars? There's too much, and when I've tried, it references things I don't know about. It loses me. Rather than make me want to consume more of the EU, it makes me worry that when I pick up another book, I'll just come to that roadblock again.

    I always thought Solomon's words were a bit of proverbial wisdom, "But beyond these, my son, be warned: there is no end to the making of many books," but maybe it was a prophecy about the Star Wars Expanded Universe! lol!

    (I am, of course, just kidding!)

    -Ecclesiastes 12:12a (HCSB)

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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  Drew.Rub on November 2nd 2012, 8:03 am

    2 things;

    1) I recently read that Disney is taking Ep 7 in a new direction, and will NOT be using any of the current written stories (books) as inspiration for the script. If I remember, the article says it will take palce after RotJ, but the length of time that has passed has been undetermined.

    2) From something I remember reading a long time ago (but in this galaxy), None of the books, movies, tv shows, etc, are released without GL approving it as universe canon. I can't verify that, but that's my recollection. So, how does that resolve them not mentioning discrepancies (Asokha never mentioned in Ep 3, for example)? I don't have a good answer there.

    One more bonus thing. Ffirst exclusive look at a set for Ep 7 here: http://t.co/TcStSucl

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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  WhiteBoy on November 2nd 2012, 10:25 am

    Drew.Rub wrote:2 things;

    1) I recently read that Disney is taking Ep 7 in a new direction, and will NOT be using any of the current written stories (books) as inspiration for the script. If I remember, the article says it will take palce after RotJ, but the length of time that has passed has been undetermined.

    I'll be interested to see how this goes. In my mind calling it Ep 7-9 implies that it's going to be a continuation of the Skywalker story. The problem with that is that it's already been so fleshed out in the Expanded Universe. So I don't know how they'll be able to do that without trampling on some of the canon.

    Drew.Rub wrote:
    2) From something I remember reading a long time ago (but in this galaxy), None of the books, movies, tv shows, etc, are released without GL approving it as universe canon. I can't verify that, but that's my recollection. So, how does that resolve them not mentioning discrepancies (Asokha never mentioned in Ep 3, for example)? I don't have a good answer there.

    I don't know that I would say George signs off on the books, tv shows, etc. There are officially several levels of canon, the highest of which are things that are from George and he's personally signed off on. The Clone Wars is in the second tier, and the books fall into the third tier. Leeland Chee is the employee of Lucasfilm that's in charge of keeping canon straight and coordinates the stories with all the contributors, and overall the canon is very consistent. There are a few discrepancies/contradictions, but they're pretty rare considering how many authors are contributing work. I wouldn't consider the lack of mentioning Ahsoka a contradiction, though... it's just simply omission. Or (honestly I haven't been keeping up with the Clone Wars series) is it possible that she's dead by the time of Episode III?

    Drew.Rub wrote:
    One more bonus thing. First exclusive look at a set for Ep 7 here: http://t.co/TcStSucl

    LOL.


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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  Dunadwarf on November 2nd 2012, 4:54 pm

    I figured that she would pretty much have to have died before ROTS. I don't know if they're still even making the Clone Wars, and if they've finished, have they officially killed her?
    I hope they do go in a new direction. It'd be the easiest way to avoid being leashed to a complex continuity that really isn't very cinematic. I'm just not sure what kind of antagonists they can use since they've eliminated every major enemy from the films. Thrawn is a great idea, but they'd be wise to create a similar character, not try to adapt the Chiss himself.

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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  Rickster on November 2nd 2012, 9:22 pm

    Now what exactly does did Disney buy? Was it just the Lucas film company or is it everything Lucas owns (thx Lucas arts etc.)

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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  BenAvery on November 2nd 2012, 10:01 pm

    It's all of Lucasfilm -- Star Wars is the big news, but it includes (from what I've heard) Indiana Jones and all that stuff.

    I'm holding out hope for Willow 2!!!

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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  Guest on November 3rd 2012, 11:35 am

    BenAvery wrote:I'm holding out hope for Willow 2!!!

    Chronicles of the Shadow War, a trilogy of full length novels that make Star Wars novels seem like their playing safe. Written by Chris Claremont, from the story outline of George Lucas. Shadow Moon, Shadow Dawn, and Shadow Star.

    A lot of fans of the movie don't like what happens between the Prologue and the first Chapter of the first book, Shadow Moon. But the second book has a really surprising and mind boggling twist, and the third book has some extraordinary revelations about the nature of Elora Danan.

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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  BenAvery on November 3rd 2012, 11:44 am

    This is what makes me frustrated with Clone Wars. Kids love it. Kids identify with Asohka. Kids like the clone troopers who are given personalities. Kids like Anakin.

    EVERY character kids like in Clone Wars will either be killed (if we are to believe that Obi Wan is the true last of the Jedi), and that means Asohka; or they will become killers, as the clones accept their orders and turn on the Jedi; or they will become mass murderers of children, as Anakin does in Revenge of the Sith.

    I just can't wrap my head around the fact that they have created a show around the adventures and exploits of future child killer Anakin Skywalker! Take that one element out, and you have a pretty fantastic sci-fi cartoon! Leave it in, and it becomes an icky feeling knowing that children love the character. Yeesh! Smile

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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  BenAvery on November 3rd 2012, 11:48 am

    Re: Willow

    I didn't bother with the books. I considered it, but when they first came out I was interested but didn't want to wait for the next book . . . and then when the second book came out, I was interested but WANTED to wait until the third book . . . and when the third book came out, I wasn't interested.

    Also, I had heard some dissatisfaction with the books, although I don';t know if it was from fans of Willow or fans of fantasy or critics. So I just figured I'd leave them be.

    Normally, I stay away from fantasy epics until they are finished. You're saying it's worth the time? I may seek them out . . .

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    Re: Breaking News

    Post  BenAvery on November 3rd 2012, 11:50 am

    Some more thoughts I've had about the news.

    Keep in mind, this comes from a fan of the movies -- my familiarity with the EU comes from the Marvel comics and some of the novels pre-Heir to the Empire (The Han Solo books and Splinter of the Minds Eye).

    http://strangersandaliens.com/2012/11/some-thoughts-about-the-disneystar-wars-news/

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